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        Whitehorse, Yukon

        Wednesday, October 27, 2004 — 1:00 p.m.

Speaker:   I will now call the House to order. We will proceed at this time with prayers.

Prayers

DAILY ROUTINE

Speaker:    We will proceed at this time with the Order Paper.

Tributes.

TRIBUTES  

In remembrance of Elly Porsild

Ms. Duncan:   “Lives Lived” is a column in one of our national newspapers, the Globe and Mail, and today I rise on behalf of all Members of the Yukon Legislative Assembly in tribute to a Yukon life well lived, that of the late Elly Porsild.

Elly was born in Denmark on January 25, 1903. A young woman who had never travelled more than 100 miles from home journeyed to Aklavik to join her about-to-be husband where they spent the first four years of married life on the Mackenzie Delta staffing the reindeer station.

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The stories of Elly’s life there are amazing. Her first child was born two weeks after their small home in Aklavik had burned to the ground. It must have been very lonely for a young woman with a new baby and no other woman to turn to for help or advice, especially when their second child was born without an esophagus two years later and died within four days. The medical services in a small hospital in Aklavik were unable to cope with such an emergency.

A brief period in Delta, B.C. preceded the young couple’s move to the Yukon — Sixtymile to be precise. Their trapping and mining life prospered with the arrival of more children: Aksel, Ellen and Johanne. From Sixtymile, Bob and Elly moved, built and ran a tourist lodge at Johnsons Crossing for 17 years before they retired and moved into Whitehorse.

These brief notes do not begin to tell the story of this incredible woman as it should be told, nor as it was so eloquently shared by her daughter Ellen Davignon.

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Words cannot convey the spirit of Elly — this tiny diminutive woman with bright blue eyes, who made such a difference throughout our community, throughout her hundred years.

If I had asked Ellie I suspect she would have been very humble about her contribution, although she might have spoken with pride of her children and grandchildren and great-grandchildren, and undoubtedly with a sparkle and frankness that was uniquely hers. She might not think to mention her volunteerism with the Yukon Council on Aging, the Golden Age Society and many other Yukon organizations. She likely wouldn’t take credit for contribution through her church of handmade blankets — her kindness and warm spirit handcrafted into each one.

Few of us probably knew of Elly and her husband Bob’s contribution to the botanical collections of the Natural Museum in Ottawa. Yukoners throughout the territory do remember Bob and Elly’s warm hospitality at Johnsons Crossing and Elly’s kindness was known especially by the staff, residents and visitors at Macaulay Lodge where she spent her last years.

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Elly Porsild, a loving mother, a leader, a teacher by word and example, was a Yukoner who will be missed. Perhaps, Mr. Speaker, the best way to remember her is to simply say, “Thank you for a life well lived, Elly. You made such a difference, and we are grateful to have shared part of your journey.”

Mr. Speaker, sharing the stories of Elly’s life, and joining us in the gallery today to pay tribute to her are her children, Ellen Davignon and Jo Brown, and grandchildren, Joanne Davignon, Lisa Schoneville and Keeley Davignon. I would ask all members to join me in welcoming them to our gallery today as we pay tribute to their mother and grandmother, Elly Porsild.

Applause

Speaker:   Any further tributes?

In recognition of Elijah Smith Elementary School

Hon. Mr. Edzerza:   Mr. Speaker, I would like to ask the House to help me welcome some guests in the gallery today: the principal, John Wright, some of his staff and some of the students from the Elijah Smith Elementary School.

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I’m pleased today to rise to pay tribute to the staff and students at Elijah Smith Elementary School. This school recently received very favourable attention in Sharing Our Success, a publication highlighting 10 case studies in aboriginal schooling. Elijah Smith Elementary was featured in the publication because of their success in providing the best possible learning environment for our students. Sharing Our Success celebrated students’ participation in the bison hunt, strong parental involvement, the breakfast program and cultural awareness, among other things.

I would like to commend John Wright, the principal, and Jan Wallace, the vice-principal, as well as the staff at Elijah Smith Elementary for their hard work and their smart and sensitive approach to schooling our First Nations students.

This government is committed to student success and lifelong learning, and Yukon schools play an integral role in enabling our students.

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Keep up the excellent work you do.

Thank you very much.

Speaker:   Are there any returns or documents for tabling?

Are there any reports of committees?

Petitions.

PETITIONS

Petition No. 3 — response

Hon. Mr. Hart:   I rise today to speak to Petition No. 3, a petition duly prepared for and accepted by this Legislature in relation to the ongoing Dawson financial situation.

First, I want to commend the signatories to this petition. I believe their willingness to sign this petition is a clear indication of the strong character of Dawson residents. Any time Yukoners engage the public democratic process in this way, they are to be commended.

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If I may, I would like to address the points raised in the petition. In particular I would like to state my agreement with the first point raised by petitioners that they did elect a mayor and council with the expectation that their votes would provide for responsible representative leadership. A Yukon government has never and would never dispute that fact.

The second point in the petition refers to the decision to remove the council. As the minister in charge I am keenly aware of the gravity of the decision, and I would state once again that it was a decision made only after a great deal of careful consideration.

These first two points are really two facets of one issue: the power of the people to elect a council and the responsibility of the council to serve their constituents. When an election is held, it is the public’s opportunity to express their views on who they believe can best represent their interests. And whenever anyone puts their name forward for election, I believe they do it out of a sincere desire to serve the public.

However, the state of Dawson’s finances is dire and required intervention. It is clear according to the Municipal Act that it was incumbent upon the Yukon government to step in and provide Dawsonites with a plan of action to deal with their financial problems.

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The Municipal Act gives clear direction to do this for the good of the residents and all Yukon taxpayers. So that’s what we did, Mr. Speaker. We stepped in to provide the necessary support.

Finally, I wish to speak to the petition’s expectation of a full accounting of how Dawson arrived at the situation it finds itself in. This government agrees. That’s why we contracted a well-recognized, independent auditing firm to conduct a full audit of Dawson’s financial situation. All Yukoners have a vested interest in the future of Dawson City, and all Yukoners deserve to know that their government is protecting their own interests. That’s what this government is doing.

As I said, I commend the petitioners for coming forward. I concur that all Yukoners want and deserve a full accounting of the situation in Dawson City. I believe this government is taking appropriate steps to ensure that happens.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Speaker:   Are there bills to be introduced?

INTRODUCTION OF BILLS

Bill No. 106: Introduction and First Reading

Mr. Hardy:   Mr. Speaker, I move that a bill entitled Act to Amend the Financial Administration Act be now introduced and read a first time.

Speaker:   It has been moved by the leader of the official opposition that a bill entitled Act to Amend the Financial Administration Act be now introduced and read a first time.

Motion for introduction and first reading of Bill No. 106 agreed to

Speaker:   Are there any further bills for introduction?

Are there any notices of motion?

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NOTICES OF MOTION

Mr. Hardy:   I give notice of the following motion:

THAT this House urges the Premier to maximize recovery of taxpayers’ money by streamlining the government’s contract with the senior advisor on electoral reform out of existence at the earliest possible opportunity.

Mr. Cardiff:   I give notice of the following motion:

THAT this House urges the minister responsible for the Yukon Workers’ Compensation Health and Safety Board to replace the current chair of the Workers’ Compensation Act review, who has allowed the process to fall almost a year behind its timeline, with someone more capable of completing the review.

Speaker:   Are there any further notices of motion?

Is there a statement by a minister?

This then brings us to Question Period.

QUESTION PERIOD

Question re:   Johne’s disease

Mrs. Peter:   My question today is for the Minister of Environment about the government’s Wildlife Preserve.

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Earlier this week the president of the non-profit society that is managing the preserve announced that most of the animals aren’t being allowed to breed this season. The reason he gave was concerns over the existence of Johne’s disease at the facility. I realize the minister isn’t a wildlife biologist or a veterinarian, but can he explain in layman’s terms how widespread Johne’s disease is at the reserve?

Hon. Mr. Jenkins:   I cannot explain the extent of Johne’s disease. I cannot explain the involvement. It is a very high priority to identify disease in not only captive wildlife but our complete wildlife population. It is an issue that the department has been working on but I’ll endeavour to get back to the member opposite with a complete — if the member so wishes we could provide the member opposite with a briefing on this issue.

Mrs. Peter:   It was quite refreshing to hear the president of the society speak so frankly about the situation at the Wildlife Preserve and why they decided not to breed the animals this year.

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I hope the minister is taking lessons from that, because his predecessor was not always so forthcoming. Did the minister and his colleagues know the extent of Johne’s disease at the Wildlife Preserve before they bought it? If they did, what effect did that have on the decision to buy out the previous owners?

Hon. Mr. Jenkins:   These are internal working details that I’m not at all familiar with. I know the issue of disease, disease identification and control is a high priority for the Department of Environment. It’s an area that we are concentrating on, not only in the captive wildlife but in the wildlife as the game is harvested. It’s an ongoing process to collect blood samples. As I outlined for the member opposite, they are very capable individuals operating the game preserve, along with the proper health authorities overseeing health in this area. I can endeavour to provide a full and complete briefing for the member opposite on this very important area.

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Mrs. Peter:   This minister had all summer to familiarize himself with this department. Several studies over the past two decades have suggested a possible relationship between Johne’s disease in animals and Crohn’s disease in humans. Last month the British Medical Association’s journal, The Lancet, reported on a recent study about the bacterium that causes Johne’s disease being found in the blood of Crohn’s disease patients.

If the minister isn’t aware of this report, I’d be happy to send him a copy. I’m sure he’ll find it very interesting. In the meantime, I’d like to follow up on a concern we hear quite often throughout the Yukon.

What steps is the minister’s department taking to ensure that domestic and wild animals in the Yukon won’t be exposed to Johne’s disease from the animals at the Wildlife Preserve?

Hon. Mr. Jenkins:   The area the game preserve is on — in fact, if the member just waits a little bit for the next budget cycle, the member opposite will clearly see there’s a double fencing in the capital budget —  which I’m sure the member opposite will not approve — that will contain the animals. There are quite a number of veterinarians and biologists within the Department of Environment, and this is an area the department has identified and is concentrating on.

I’m sure the department has a copy of the report the member opposite referred to in-house. That is not my field of expertise.

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We have some very capable staff in-house who address these issues. It has been identified as a high priority for the department and it is something that is constantly monitored and being dealt with.

Question re:  Tombstone Territorial Park

 Mrs. Peter:   My question is again to the Minister of Environment. The government issued the orders-in-council establishing the Tombstone Territorial Park last Friday. Section 1(3) of Schedule A in chapter 10 of the Tr’ondëk Hwëch’in Final Agreement requires Yukon to establish the Tombstone Territorial Park as a natural environment park as soon as practical following the determination of the boundaries of the park. Those boundaries were determined and publicly announced in December 1999. Why did it take so long for this government to establish that park?

Hon. Mr. Jenkins:   I would say the park was proceeded with at the most rapid of paces. If you want a comparison to another park that was established under a previous administration and finally concluded under our administration, that is Fishing Branch, which took seven years. Tombstone Park took four years from the time the process was started by government to the time the order-in-council was passed. It was dealt with at a Cabinet meeting last Thursday and I believe the Commissioner signed the order-in-council on Friday establishing Tombstone Park. It is our government’s intention — and it always has been — to establish Tombstone Park in full compliance with the Tr’ondëk Hwëch’in Final Agreement, and that has been done by our government.

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Mrs. Peter:   Mr. Speaker, on Monday, the minister said that the orders-in-council were developed in-house. He said he tried to call the Tr’ondëk Hwëch’in chief but failed. Can the minister table the details of the consultations and meetings he had had, and that the previous minister did hold with the Tr’ondëk Hwëch’in First Nation on the establishment of the park?

Hon. Mr. Jenkins:   Mr. Speaker, there were many meetings over a number of years leading up to the creation of Tombstone Park. The final order-in-council creating Tombstone Park was created in-house by the Government of Yukon. It’s an internal document. It is in full compliance with the Tr’ondëk Hwëch’in Final Agreement. The next step is the creation of the management plan, and some work has been done on the management plan to date. I’m hopeful that that will come to fruition in short order also.

Mrs. Peter:   Mr. Speaker, in order to establish a park, there are many environmental issues that need to be addressed. First Nations need to feel that their concerns have been met within their traditional territories. The Tr’ondëk Hwëch’in First Nation has been very vocal that their concerns have not been met by the establishment of this park. Again I ask the minister: can he table the meetings that he had with Tr’ondëk Hwëch’in, and what steps does the minister plan to take to address any remaining issues?

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Hon. Mr. Jenkins:   The park has been established by order-in-council. That fulfills part of our government’s agreement to the    , which is to establish a park. The next step that we will be taking as a government is to create the management plan. And there has been work underway with the department and Tr’ondëk Hwëch’in to establish the management plan. That is the next step in this undertaking. As far as I am concerned — and I am sure a great many Yukoners are concerned — we as a government have fulfilled our obligation under the Tr’ondëk Hwëch’in Self-Government Agreement to create Tombstone Park.

It is a park — a live, living park. It has been created. It is there.

Question re: Education Act review

Ms. Duncan:    I have some questions for the Minister of Education. For two years the government has glided along with a legislation-light agenda. We’ve seen work on major pieces of legislation grind to a halt under the Yukon Party government — a government that simply refuses to do the hard work of governing. The Workers’ Compensation Act review stalled, the new Liquor Act stalled, and in the minister’s department, the Education Act stalled. There are just three examples.

Section 205 of the Education Act requires in law that the act be reviewed every 10 years. That review began in 1999 under an NDP government and continued under our government. As soon as the Yukon Party took office the work ended.

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That review is mandatory. It is required by law. The minister is not living up to the laws that we pass in this Legislature by not living up to section 205 of the act. When will Yukoners see the new Education Act in this Legislature?

Hon. Mr. Edzerza:   The member opposite was right when she stated that there was supposed to be an Education Act review. That’s true, but that’s all it states, Mr. Speaker. It doesn’t say that it has to be revised or rewritten. It just says it has to be reviewed.

Ms. Duncan:   So the minister has just stood on his feet and proved my point. The Yukon Party isn’t prepared to do the hard work of governing.

The Education Act, section 205, was put there for a reason by the Legislature that said this act shall be reviewed with the intent that any legislative needs that aren’t being met would be and would be dealt with.

Last Thursday, the Premier claimed that the government is making progress on educational reform. That’s not the case either. There has been no reform of our education system under this government. For two years the Yukon Party has refused to work on the Education Act, and the government is ducking the issue because it requires a lot of hard work and it requires listening, two things the Yukon Party isn’t prepared to do.

Why is the Yukon Party stalling on the Education Act and on education reform? Why is that?

Hon. Mr. Edzerza:   I mean no disrespect to the member opposite; however, the member is wrong again. This party does work hard; this party does listen. The member opposite did have the opportunity to fulfill the commitments to the Education Act but didn’t. This government seems to be in the process of cleaning up a lot of things from previous governments, and I must say they left a lot of work for us to do.

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Ms. Duncan:   Mr. Speaker, the legislative cupboard for this fall sitting is completely bare. The only real piece of legislation is the cover-your-act changes to the Motor Vehicles Act to stop the Minister of Justice from interfering with tow trucks.

The Yukon Party election platform made this commitment: seek a consensus from all stakeholders about the Education Act review. The partners in education are waiting for that review to begin. Parents, teachers, school councils, First Nations — we all want this work to go ahead. The only thing stopping it is the government and its fear of hard work. It has been two years. When is the minister going to start the much-needed and promised and legislated review of the Education Act and the education reform talked about by the Premier? When is that going to happen?

Hon. Mr. Edzerza:   Again I want to confirm in the House that this government is not afraid of hard work, and it’s clearly demonstrated in the amount of progress that has been made on the education front and the economic development front, First Nation relationships — everything is going along fairly well, Mr. Speaker, as a matter of fact. This government believes that good legislation is better than poor legislation. If you’re going to produce legislation, it has to be good. I think it is a credit to any government that they don’t produce legislation just for the sake of producing legislation. And I commend this government for really looking at the legislation and being selective about what they bring forward.

Question re:  Ambulance contracts

Mr. McRobb:   The Health minister has a lot of explaining to do regarding his role in the purchase of two box ambulances. Instead of allowing experts within the department to order three new Suburban ambulances, the minister interfered and sole-sourced a contract for two box ambulances. Not only is the minister’s choice more difficult for paramedics to use, these dual-wheel four-wheel-drive units cost a whole lot more. And among other concerns, they can’t fit into all ambulance bays in the territory.

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How can this minister possibly believe the public received good value for its money, and will he commit to never interfering like this again?

Hon. Mr. Jenkins:   It’s obvious that the member opposite knows not of what he speaks. The issue of the type I ambulance is a standard across North America today. The issue of four-wheel drive is of paramount importance in some of our rural areas.

But the question should have been: what has our government done for the emergency medical services? We have spent $250,000 on capital, providing new ambulances. We’ve provided another $200,000 for clothing. We’ve provided additional training. There’s a full-time trainer now on staff. In addition to that, honorariums have been increased for our rural EMS. So there is a whole series of initiatives that this government has undertaken to address the emergency medical services. We are very proud of our accomplishments in this area. One only has to look across the Yukon to see the effect of this infusion of money into the capital and O&M of this very important area.

Mr. McRobb:   I would like to add that the minister neglected to mention the $80,000 he spent to modify the ambulance bay in Ross River so the new box ambulance would even fit into the building.

Now, as stated, this minister has a lot of explaining to do. He refused to answer written questions on this matter. In fact, he pompously brushed off the eight questions —

Unparliamentary language

Speaker:   Order. Accusing a member of being pompous is not parliamentary, and I would ask the member not to do that.

Mr. McRobb:   He brushed off the eight questions asked of him in a July 28 public letter. It’s high time this minister shed some light on how he sole-sourced the contract. Contrary to normal practice, he circumvented the government’s own procedures and awarded the contract to a Surrey, B.C. company. The limit for sole sourcing is $50,000. In this case it was five times that amount. Why did the minister interfere in the tendering process, and will he commit to never doing that again?

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Hon. Mr. Jenkins:   The minister did not interfere. Sole-source contracts have a role and a place. If the member opposite would like to check the government Web site, the member opposite will find that the Minister of Health probably signs off on more sole-source contracts than any other minister in the Government of Yukon.

Mr. McRobb:   This minister interfered with a tendering process that was working just fine. In fact, just a few months earlier an ambulance was tendered through normal channels quite successfully. One of the problems caused by the minister’s interference was sole-sourcing an open-ended contract without specifying a deadline for delivery. This resulted in a delivery time of seven months. According to the contract, the minister was satisfied with “as soon as possible” instead of insisting on a set delivery deadline. Giving contractors such indefinite parameters is unheard of.

Why would the minister give an open-ended delivery date to this contractor? This goes against normal practice and smacks of favouritism. Why did he do that?

Hon. Mr. Jenkins:   As I pointed out the member opposite in my letter to him, to the best of my knowledge, all government contracting regulations were adhered to with respect to the purchase of these ambulances. I stand on our record and there is a complete audit on all government contracts. This was a much-needed piece of equipment that we committed to purchasing and this was done. So I don’t know if I should be apologizing to the Member for Kluane for undertaking my role and fulfilling my obligations to the people of the Yukon by providing new ambulances, but I doubt not.

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Question re:  Ambulances

Mr. Cardiff:   I have a follow-up question for the Minister of Health and Social Services about ambulances. Now that these ambulances are in use, some concerns have been raised about the actual ambulances. Due to the size of the ambulance, lifting a stretcher into one of these huge ambulances is much more difficult and takes considerably more effort on the part of the attendants.

It’s my understanding there have been at least six injuries and WCB claims related to lifting stretchers into the ambulances. How many injury claims related to the use of the new ambulances is the minister aware of?

Hon. Mr. Jenkins:   The four-wheel-drive ambulances are higher off the ground than a standard ambulance — that’s a given. The request was for four-wheel-drive ambulances from a number of areas. There will probably be a need for more four-wheel-drive ambulances that are higher off the ground than standard ambulances but the standard for ambulances across the country is directed toward a type 1 type of ambulance.

Mr. Cardiff:   The minister should be concerned about this in his other role as minister responsible for the Workers’ Compensation Health and Safety Board because it’s going to affect how they operate.

The minister personally meddled in the purchasing of the ambulances and he doesn’t appear to be concerned about the rights of the workers. Workers in any occupation have a right, under the Workers’ Compensation Act and the Occupational Health and Safety Act, to refuse unsafe work.

Can the minister tell us how many ambulance workers have refused to use the new ambulances for fear of injury and unsafe work?

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Hon. Mr. Jenkins:   The Public Service Commission is the agency that hires and looks after — and unless something comes to my desk separate and distinct, we do not interfere with the operations of the Public Service Commission.

Mr. Cardiff:   This minister isn’t responsible for anything any more. He’s not responsible for the ambulances, he’s not responsible for the injuries to the workers and he’s not responsible for the act review.

The minister has got to be aware of these problems because they’re in both of his portfolios. He’s responsible for the ambulances; he’s responsible for the Workers’ Compensation Act.

My understanding of the minister’s solution is that he’s going to pawn these ambulances off on the communities, on communities outside of Whitehorse. I don’t know what he’s hoping. Maybe he thinks it’s a case of out of sight, out of mind. So does the minister really believe that sending ambulances to outlying communities is going to fix this problem, and in which communities can ambulance workers expect to face the choice of whether or not to work with these white-and-orange elephants?

Hon. Mr. Jenkins:   Our government will stand on its record of what we have done for emergency medical services here in the Yukon. In one budget cycle we have put $250,000 into capital acquisitions: two type 1, four-wheel-drive ambulances. There is a demonstrated need for four-wheel-drive ambulances in many, many parts of the Yukon. In addition, we have put $200,000 into clothing. In addition to that, we have increased honorariums, the first time that honorariums have been increased for volunteer EMS staff.

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And that has not been done since the 1970s. So when you add it all up, we have put over half a million dollars into this area — very, very important — and we acknowledge, recognize and respect the efforts and initiatives of our volunteers in the emergency medical services across the Yukon.

Question re:  Tantalus School, Yukon College campus at

Mr. Fairclough:   My question is for the Minister of Education.

This minister’s attitude toward the work and the time spent by his own school planning committee in good faith in Carmacks is appalling. This minister has unilaterally made his own decision, prompted by who knows. He told us yesterday that the decision on the school is final. The uncertainty he has created for all future consultation is obvious.

This minister has breached the agreement he made with the Little Salmon-Carmacks First Nation a year ago. The agreement states that the Little Salmon-Carmacks First Nation and the Government of Yukon agreed to: “work together in a spirit of cooperation and partnership in connection with planning toward the establishment of a new school facility to be located in Carmacks.” And I have that for tabling, Mr. Speaker.

Why did the minister go out of his way to breach the agreement?

Hon. Mr. Edzerza:   Again I will start by correcting the member opposite. This minister didn’t go out of his way to breach anything. As a matter of fact, this minister went to great lengths to understand the situation in Carmacks.

Mr. Speaker, the member opposite would like to have the public believe that every citizen in Carmacks is in agreement with not having the campus attached to the school. I say today that that’s not true. The fact is that I have had members from Carmacks who could not get an appointment with the member opposite and drove all the way from Carmacks to sit in my office and talk about their approval of the campus being attached to the school.

So, Mr. Speaker, it’s not unanimous in the community, and this is something this government has been grappling with since day one.

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Now, there’s a big picture here, Mr. Speaker. The member opposite appears to have tunnel vision and only wants to see through that tunnel. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Fairclough:   Well, his colleagues cheer for him once again, but I’m talking about an intergovernmental agreement that minister signed off on, and he breached it. So what good are government agreements with First Nations? Not the paper it’s written on, obviously, Mr. Speaker. Let’s go on.

In this agreement, there is a workplan for the committee. Section 4.2 of the agreement states that the committee may — I stress the word “may” — also consider specific recommendations regarding the possible incorporation of the College campus in the school facility or adjacent to the school facility. So why did the minister choose to ignore this section of the agreement?

Hon. Mr. Edzerza:   Again, Mr. Speaker, this minister did not ignore anything. Mr. Speaker, there has been a lot of controversy from day one about this very positive project. The safety of the children is paramount to this government, and I believe I stated from day one on this project that this government will not allow this to be a political football. It has been a very, very hard struggle to keep it from becoming that. Mr. Speaker, as the minister, I will continue to do my job, which is to provide public infrastructure for education.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Mr. Fairclough:   It was this minister who broke his word. He broke his word to the First Nation. After signing off an agreement and then announcing it in the House that he made an agreement with the First Nation, he broke his word over and over again. It’s quite obvious that the First Nation is upset about it. They demonstrated outside of this House — some 50 to 60 people along with support from other First Nations around the territory. So the member opposite needs to take those types of things seriously. Just think about what the signs out there said.

The agreement mentions chapter 22 of the First Nation’s final agreement and it commits the government to maximize benefits during construction of the school. It also promises pre-construction training. The minister hasn’t said anything about that yet. It’s only a matter of seven months away. Will there be training for the First Nations, or is this just another broken promise?

Hon. Mr. Edzerza:   I would like to state for the record that in my opinion this whole agreement with the First Nation was to focus specifically on the training issues, and it will happen. Unlike previous governments, Carmacks will see a school. There are no broken promises here. The promise was that this government will produce a school, and we will. To the citizens in Carmacks, I think I show the utmost respect to them. And the demonstration that was mentioned is merely democracy in action. They have that right to do that, and I applaud them for doing it.

Speaker:   The time for Question Period has now elapsed. We will proceed to Orders of the Day.

ORDERS OF THE DAY

GOVERNMENT PRIVATE MEMBERS’ BUSINESS

MOTIONS OTHER THAN GOVERNMENT MOTIONS

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Motion No. 332

Clerk:   Motion No. 332, standing in the name of Mr. Hassard.

Speaker:  It has been moved by the Member for Pelly-Nisutlin

THAT this House urges the Yukon government to work with the Royal Canadian Legion to design and develop a veterans licence plate in recognition of Yukon veterans and their efforts to protect our country and preserve peace around the world.

Mr. Hassard:   It is an honour to bring forward this motion today as I feel this is a very important matter. I will tell the Member for Mayo-Tatchun just how I feel about that.

I feel it is important for us to give recognition to the very people who fought for our right to the freedom and democracy that we have today, which allows us to be here in the Legislature. Whether they are veterans of the World Wars or peacekeepers of today, they put their lives on the line for us and they put the good of all others ahead of their own well-being.

This licence plate, in my mind, is only a small token of the appreciation and it is the least that we can do for this remarkable group of people.

We have the opportunity to be the eighth jurisdiction in Canada to take this step. The Northwest Territories, British Columbia, New Brunswick, Ontario, Nova Scotia, Prince Edward Island and Newfoundland already have a veterans plate available. Other provinces are looking at doing the same in the very near future.

I would like to thank our Tourism and Culture minister for doing a lot of the legwork that has gotten us to this point. I believe that she has been working with a constituent to bring this matter to light, and I thank her for that. My hope is that, with the Royal Canadian Legion at our side, we can develop a plate that is appealing to all Yukoners and that also easily identifies our veterans.

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I would like this plate to be something that all Yukoners can be proud of. I’m sure that over the course of the next hour or two or four — whatever it may be — we will hear many suggestions as to what this plate can look like, and I look forward to that discussion.

I believe that the Royal Canadian Legion can play a large role in this licence plate, not only by giving us the advice, as they were obviously some of the people involved, but perhaps by being involved in the authorizing of any of the application forms according to their records. If by chance there are veterans who are not in their records, then I hope that we can find a way to get them in that process as well.

Given the small jurisdiction by population that we are, it’s fairly obvious that we’re not going to have a large number of veterans here. It is my understanding that there are approximately 100 at this time. So it would be my desire to see this plate offered to those people at no charge. What I see is that this is a possible process for acquiring a licence plate that is fairly simple. If a veteran wishes to acquire a plate, the vet would get the application and the eligibility certification form from the Legion for the motor vehicle branch. The veteran would then fill out the form and attach the proof of service. The form could be sent to the Legion with a small processing fee. The Legion would verify the info and stamp the form as acknowledging that the applicant is eligible. This signed and stamped form is then returned to the applicant and the applicant then acquires the veteran plate through the motor vehicle branch.

November 11 will soon be upon us again, and November 11 is a day that all Canadians remember those who served in Canada’s armed forces. We honour the memory of the fallen and those left behind.

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As a child growing up in Teslin, I remember every year the assembly of students in the gymnasium, and many times we would have veterans come in and speak to us about their experiences. I remember being taught the importance of the poppy, and I remember how proud we were as kids to go and pay for those poppies, dropping the quarters in, or whatever money we had, to pay for the poppy. We were told to be very proud of this, and to this day I still make a point of getting a poppy on that occasion.

Mr. Speaker, with the ever-decreasing number of veterans as time goes by, it becomes more important for those of us who have heard the stories first-hand to teach the younger people what November 11 and our veterans really mean to us. I was fortunate enough to grow up with a close family friend who is a World War II veteran, a fellow by the name of Mike Warren, who still lives in Teslin at the ripe young age of 81. And over the years he has made sure that I and other members of my family are very aware of the sacrifices made by Canadian soldiers — whether it was the stories of going to England in a ship and all the struggles of being on the ship, how crowded and uncomfortable it was and how sick they were. He mentions that regularly. And I can just imagine being a young man at that time and leaving your home near the Rocky Mountains and being stuck on a ship, headed across the ocean with probably very little understanding of where you were even going. It must have been quite a time. And these people gave up years of their lives over there fighting to protect the very reason that we are here today.

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INTRODUCTION OF VISITORS

Mr. Hassard:   Mr. Speaker, if I could just bring your attention to the corner of the gallery for a moment. With us is my wife and my son, Ty — if I could ask all members to join me in welcoming them.

I see in the press gallery my other son, Simon.

Applause

Mr. Hassard:   Mr. Speaker, moving right along, I know for a fact that those children will grow up with the same respect for veterans and November 11 that I have. I feel it is my duty to do that, to make sure they understand it. For generations to come, we must make sure they understand what was sacrificed. One could only wonder where we would be without that sacrifice. I wonder if we would enjoy the same freedoms we have today and all the opportunities that are afforded to us.

In my mind, we are quite lucky. We have the luxury of living and working anywhere in Canada, we can travel from province to province and territory to territory without having to get permission. We have essentially unguarded borders with another country, and we’re free to roam about as we please. We can attend schools anywhere in the country, we can take jobs in any province or territory we choose, and we have that right because we’re a free country.

Mr. Speaker, I remember vividly the images of the falling of the Berlin Wall and the celebration of the people getting their first taste of freedom. I was living in Oshawa, Ontario, at the time and was learning to fly an airplane. Imagine that, being 23 years old, living freely on my own, thousands of miles from where I was born and grew up, and basically free, and on TV we saw people who were 50 and 60 years old being able to leave their country for the first time ever. To me, it’s amazing that we do have what we have.

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I’m certainly thankful for what we do have.

Mr. Speaker, we hear much talk in the Yukon about tourism and the beautiful place we have around us, but I can’t imagine if this wasn’t a free country how many tourists we would have. I can’t imagine anyone going on vacation to a place such as Iraq. I don’t think it would matter what the scenery or the climate was, we wouldn’t be going there. We live in a great place and we owe an awful lot of it to our veterans.

And I don’t believe it makes any difference whether you’re an environmentalist or a hard-core, two-stroke, cold-smoke person such as myself. I believe we’ve all benefited from what we’ve seen sacrificed.

The Member for Lake Laberge finds humour in my reference.

I’m sure we’ll have our disagreements over how we should take care of our country, how we should use it, and how we should govern it, but the bottom line is that we all benefited from the sacrifice of other people.

One of the things I commonly hear from friends and relatives is how good it is to be a Canadian when you’re travelling. I’m sure everyone in this Legislature has heard that. It’s common knowledge that Canadians are accepted and thought highly of, for the most part, all over the world. And I truly believe that part of that is due to our record as peacekeepers and liberators. When you talk to people from Europe who witnessed what our soldiers did over there, you soon learn how grateful they are to our Canadian soldiers.

And Canadians are recognized as playing a huge role in the World Wars. Our peacekeepers are asked to help out around the world on a regular basis. Quite often, they are sent to countries that are trying to have elections, and those people are in need of help to ensure that they are carried out in a fair and safe manner.

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Perhaps at this time I could make mention of a young man from Teslin by the name of Roscoe Wiseman, who is currently a member of our military. I have had several occasions to talk to him about his travels and while a lot of it is fun, I’m sure, there are times when he’s in situations that I’m sure a lot of us don’t want to be in. He has shown me many pictures and told lots of stories of what it’s like to be there. I certainly commend him and thank him for being devoted to do that. I’m sure it’s not the easiest thing to do. I get the impression from him that Canadian soldiers are considered to be perhaps more fair and sincere in their work than peacekeepers from other nations who are doing the same type of work. Canadians are held in a very high regard, and I think, as Canadians, we should all be proud of that.

While most of us don’t necessarily consider peacekeeping the most dangerous activity for a soldier, there are many dangers just the same. One only has to think back a few short weeks ago to the fire on the HMCS Chicoutami, a fire that resulted in the death of one of the crew members. Even though they were not in the midst of battle or in combat, the nature of the job is such that a life can be lost at any time. It’s unfortunate that we had to see the wife and children of that submariner having to deal with that sacrifice. That is, in my mind, the ultimate sacrifice.

We cannot forget Canadian soldiers killed by friendly fire. A number of years back, a bomb dropped accidentally from a U.S. plane taking the lives of more Canadian soldiers. And those people, I’m sure, thought they were in a safe and secure environment.

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Mr. Speaker, the Canadian military has also played a large role in developing the Yukon Territory. Whitehorse was home to a large number of Canadian soldiers after the Second World War. There were many things that they did; among those, I’m sure, was maintaining and upgrading the Alaska Highway and taking care of our airports and improving them.

Mr. Speaker, there is so much that could be said, and I’m sure we’ll have lots of discussion about it today as to all the good reasons for having this veterans plate. So I’ll basically wrap things up by saying that I believe that by working with the Royal Canadian Legion we can ensure that all Canadian veterans, peacekeepers and other Canadians who served in the Allied forces will be able to receive this licence plate. The Royal Canadian Legion has over 400,000 members and affiliates. It has 1,600 branches in Canada, 21 in the United States and four in Germany. So I believe they are positioned very well to play a large role in this endeavour.

So with that, Mr. Speaker, I will open the floor, and I look forward to hearing unanimous support for this worthwhile cause.

Mr. McRobb:   I am also very proud to stand on behalf of the official opposition and speak in favour of this motion this afternoon. Certainly all Canadian veterans deserve our respect and support always.

Mr. Speaker, in the territory today, we still have a number of veterans. There are two First Nations veterans in the Kluane riding. They are rather distinguished and have been in this Legislature before as part of tributes and certain notable events.

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They are Alex Van Bibber and John Adamson.  They also have the case with the federal government about outstanding compensation for their role in World War II, which was never officially recognized until recently.

My father also served in World War II and went over in one of those rusty boats the previous speaker mentioned and came back on the Queen Elizabeth I. He was part of the second wave that landed in Holland and advanced into France and Germany. One thing of note I can recall from listening to my father’s recollections is that on VE Day he was in Trafalgar Square, and I would imagine the party at that location on that day was something to behold.

Dedicating a licence plate to the veterans is a small measure that we in this House can do to show our appreciation, and I believe it will go a long way to delivering that message to our veterans and other people in the territory that the respect toward our veterans continues for all they accomplished some 60 years ago in World War II and in other wars previously and in other terms of service this country has been part of.

Rather than get into suggestions for the design of the licence plates, I would submit that that is something that we should wait to hear about from veterans themselves, and possibly look at their suggestions and decide what to do.

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I’m also a bit inquisitive as to the motion today and its purpose, when in fact it’s something that was doable by the Yukon Party government both in terms of the budget for this main year and the supplementary budget that will be tabled here tomorrow. This government could easily have identified funds for this purpose and could have done it rather than having us just talk about it today. So I’m a little puzzled about that. This is something that, if everybody is supportive, perhaps we can amend the budget to provide for such funds for this purpose. Certainly we would consider being a part of a united effort to do that.

I can go on but, out of respect for my colleagues, I think everybody should have an opportunity to get up and have their say today and possibly identify their constituents of note who have served in battle for our country.

Hon. Ms. Taylor:    It is indeed my honour and privilege to stand before members of this Legislature to speak to this very important motion before us put forward by my colleague. I have to say that one of the great things about serving office as a member of the Legislative Assembly is to be able to act upon initiatives that are raised by constituents — initiatives that are great ideas, that are recommendations for improving how we deliver services and programs in the territory on behalf of Yukoners, and initiatives that certainly recognize the significant contributions of our own Yukon people.

As such, with that said, I have to say that I’m very pleased to be able to stand here before Members of the Legislative Assembly not to pay recognition to our government for bringing forward this motion, but really to thank my constituent Wayne Wannamker for raising this very important initiative with me a few months ago.

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It was actually back in June, as I recall, when Wayne had given me a call and, I believe, members of the opposition as well. He was seeking the support of all Members of the Legislative Assembly to perhaps have our consideration to go forward with this very important initiative. With that said, I immediately thought, “This is a great idea.” I was not as familiar with this initiative as I perhaps could have been, but immediately after taking the phone call, I did a bit of research myself. Also, thanks to Mr. Wannamker for forwarding additional information to my office.

I really became familiar that this is certainly not a new initiative, as my colleague to the right had mentioned this initiative. The veterans licence plate program has actually been in effect in a number of jurisdictions across Canada and across the United States. As the Member for Pelly-Nisutlin mentioned, the veterans-recognition licence plates are certainly commonplace.

There are a number of provinces and territories that already have this initiative in place, including the Northwest Territories, British Columbia, New Brunswick, Ontario, Nova Scotia, Prince Edward Island and Newfoundland. I also understand that Saskatchewan, as well as Alberta, are in the process of adopting such a plate as well. In fact, Alberta made that announcement back in August of this year. I am also familiar that the State of Alaska has also progressed with this initiative.

So I think the reason for bringing forward this motion is two-fold. For one, it’s a very important initiative. As the Member for Kluane just said, it is a small token of appreciation, but I believe it really brings significant symbolism — certainly our recognition. And thanks to the many veterans, men and women around the world, especially here in Canada, who have served in times of war as well as in times of peace.

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So I am very supportive of this initiative, and I am very happy to be a part of a government that is taking steps to look at the development of a licence plate program here in the Yukon.

Now, we all know veterans, I’m sure, in each of our ridings, certainly among family and friends. Well, my grandfather was a merchant marine. My cousin’s husband is also a long-time peacekeeper who has served throughout the world — many, many years over the last 20 years. So I think that we are all very familiar with the many contributions that are brought forward by Canadians, both men and women, on a day-to-day basis. We are forever in their debt for their contributions, again in times of peace and in war.

Mr. Speaker, on June 6, 1944, 15,000 Canadian soldiers landed at Juno Beach as part of the Allied invasion of Normandy, which eventually led to the end of World War II in Europe. On June 6, 2004, the 60^th anniversary of what has become known as D-Day was remembered and was celebrated by all Yukoners here and across the territory. I was very pleased and proud to take part in that particular anniversary, remembrance, celebration of D-Day here in the City of Whitehorse. It really was a very special time. There was a huge gathering of Yukoners outside of the City Hall and it was an opportunity for all of us to honour our veterans and the sacrifices they made on our behalf.

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I think it’s very fitting that we do certainly look at providing all our support from all parties to proceed with this very important initiative, and it’s very timely that it is the 60^th anniversary of D-Day. We also have Remembrance Day coming up on November 11.

We are certainly looking forward to soliciting all-party support on this initiative. Again I thank my colleague, the Member for Pelly-Nisutlin, for bringing forward this motion.

As I expressed earlier, an official plate sends a clear signal that the Government of Yukon recognizes the contribution of veterans and is very willing to commemorate their efforts, and that is exactly what this initiative is intended to be.

As has been mentioned earlier, currently all other jurisdictions leave the veterans designation to local veterans organizations like the Royal Canadian Legion. I suppose if the territory adopted a similar approach, Yukoners who want this plate would pick up an application at the motor vehicles branch or the Legion, would complete the form and would return it to the Legion for certification. Therefore, the completed application could then be brought forward to motor vehicles branch and the plate could be issued.

This is but one idea and is a form of communication that is used by other provinces that previously adopted this initiative.

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As I understand it, to implement this initiative there would need to be an amendment to the regulations proscribing licence plates and validation tabs, so it certainly is not a very lengthy process. It’s not a cumbersome process. I also do not think it would require a lot of resources to complete.

As I mentioned, other provinces — Nova Scotia and British Columbia — and just recently on June 1 the Northwest Territories government announced that it would also honour veterans by introducing this very program. Certainly in all of my research I have found some very similar attributes among all programs offered in the provinces and territories right now. Some of those are that, under the programs, a veteran is defined as a person who has honourably served in the Armed Forces of Canada, the Commonwealth or its wartime allies for a minimum of three years, may still be serving, or served in the merchant navy or a ferry command in war time, or served in a theatre of war with the Armed Forces of Canada, the Commonwealth or its wartime allies, or performed NATO service on peacekeeping missions within the Armed Forces of Canada.

Again, as the MLA for Kluane had mentioned earlier, it certainly isn’t for myself or any of us to dictate who would be eligible and who would not be eligible under this program, but rather, as the motion indicates, I think what is very clearly important is that collaboration take place in the respective department as well as the Royal Canadian Legion, the Yukon branch, in defining who should be eligible or not eligible.

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But certainly, as with previous provinces in adopting this initiative, there seems to be some very similar characteristics in their eligibility criteria.

There is also a whole variety of ways of administering the plate when it comes to costs. Some jurisdictions have been able to offer, free of charge, an exchange of the plate for their previous current plate, or in other jurisdictions such as Ontario, I understand there is a $5 administration fee that is charged by the Legion to verify eligibility for administration costs.

It certainly seems to be a pretty minor cost, if at all, if there is to be a cost incurred. I think that clearly the message is that we want to proceed further with this very important initiative. It is very symbolic and it certainly shows the respect and appreciation to the veterans who have served or continue to serve our country. Whether they have served in times of war or in times of peace, men and women of this country have worked hard to maintain a sense of peace in our country as well as maintain that sense of peace outside of our borders, for which we are very grateful to them.  We are here to remember soldiers, sailors, aircrews — you name it.

As has been mentioned before, I think it’s really important that this motion be brought forward to the Legislature for all-party support because I think it is a very important initiative that does deserve all of our recognition.

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And certainly this will raise the awareness of the licence plate program, as well. I think it is really important for all of us as members to have the opportunity to say a few words. I believe that we should go forward with this initiative, and we should move accordingly. We should continue to work with the Royal Canadian Legion. Again I think it is very important, given the importance of this initiative, that we give all members of this Legislature the opportunity to say a few words.

With respect to the design, the licence plate here in the Yukon has certainly been anything but an easy process. It has served to divide Yukoners at times, but I think we have a great licence plate currently in place. I think with a bit of creativity, perhaps this new veterans plate could incorporate most attributes of our current plate, but by giving some recognition to the veterans, either in the name itself or through a symbol of the veterans. Again, I would defer that matter, and I would certainly recommend that the respective department work very closely with the Royal Canadian Legion and our veterans to determine what design fits well for all Yukoners.

Here in the Yukon, as we all know, veterans and soldiers have all played a very important role in the development of the Yukon. Just looking to my hometown of Watson Lake, the construction of the Alaska Highway, the incredible international historical landmark, which was a feat in itself — an engineering feat, I should add — is indicative of the very importance that the army did serve here in the Yukon in providing an access corridor, a transportation corridor, an access of security and safety. It also helped develop further some of our communities.

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Today it now has actually progressed from being a transportation corridor to a very popular visitor attraction among people from all over the world. So, for that, we say thank you as well.

I don’t have much more to add. I think this is a pretty straightforward motion. I am very supportive of this initiative, and I would urge the government to move forward expeditiously, I would encourage all members on the opposite side of the House to join us in supporting this program, and I look forward to hearing further comments in support.

Ms. Duncan:   I would like to recognize and express my appreciation to the members opposite who brought the motion forward, the Member for Pelly-Nisutlin for tabling the motion and the Minister of Tourism and Culture for not only speaking in support of the motion but also presenting today some significant homework that was done on the background. We don’t see a lot of this kind of cooperation in the Legislature and this kind of cooperation and — as others said earlier — to be able to act and make a difference with an issue brought forward by a constituent, that’s what makes the job worthwhile. I appreciate the opportunity to speak to the motion.

I believe that this motion was brought forward and brought forward in this way in the Legislature, rather than just passing regulations, to give us all an opportunity to speak in favour of it and also to be able to express as a House our unanimous support for this motion, and I hope it will receive unanimous support.

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I would also like to recognize the efforts of Wayne Wannamker, who has been tireless in his efforts to help us to recognize veterans, not only in this manner but in other initiatives that have been brought forward before the House. It is an honour to serve such constituents as they have served us.

The Member for Pelly-Nisutlin mentioned the challenge of conveying to our children the depth and the breadth of the sacrifice — the “why” we will remember them and the significance of the poppy. I would also like to note for all members the new Canadian quarter this year: the coin with the poppy on it. It’s another way we’ve recognized, as Canadians, the service of our veterans. And it helps us to convey to our children how important it is and what the significance of the poppy is.

I’d also like to recognize the people who help us to teach our children to remember the “why”. I would specifically like to mention the principals, teachers and staff at two of the schools in my riding: principal Jim Tredger at Jack Hulland School and principal Kerry Huff at Porter Creek Secondary School, and their staffs. I’d especially like to remind members about the service — if they ever have an opportunity to attend it — at Porter Creek Secondary School. It’s held on November 10 so it’s not competing with, if you will, the November 11 ceremonies that I have attended for years in my Brownie uniform, and in other capacities, at F.H. Collins.

The service, prepared by the high school students at Porter Creek Secondary School, is very, very well done and it’s an honour to attend.

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Another way that I have tried to encourage my children to understand, and another additional source of support in teaching and explaining the sacrifice, has been my children’s grandparents. My mother-in-law and my mother both served in the Canadian Armed Forces. My father’s service I would also like to recognize today, as we are recognizing veterans. Flight Lieutenant Thomas Faulkner Duncan served in the Royal Air Force and his service record, including teaching Canadian pilots in Ontario, is quite lengthy. We are reminded of that service with his squadron crests hanging in our family home, as well as the commendation from the king.

It’s my father’s service that really struck me when Mr. Wannamker and I spoke about this because my concern is that the Allied forces also be able to be recognized. My concern with that is that I know that certainly my father is not the only individual. The Yukon is such a multicultural and unique society in all of Canada. We have many, many Americans who live in our communities. In my riding I can think of several who may also have had service — Yukon driver’s licence and Yukon vehicles. I would like to see this opportunity extended to them as well.

I also fully respect that it’s the Royal Canadian Legion that we should work with and they should determine the criteria. I would just ask that these individuals be given consideration as well in our recommendation and that we not leave these individuals out.

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I don’t in any way downplay the contribution of Canadian citizens in this respect either. I mean no disrespect to anyone. I am trying to convey a desire to the Legion to work with them and to be open and to encourage the recognition of Yukon veterans.

I just would like to close my comments with a couple of suggestions. I certainly fully support the motion, and as it is worded. I am not suggesting these as amendments to the motion, just simply as suggestions that I would like to put forward as the government works with the Legion in the preparation of this initiative. I believe it is very, very important that we do this. It is very timely that we do this. “Just do it” is my comment to the Cabinet in dealing with the regulations. That being said, I would strongly encourage working with the Legion on the criteria, and I would not venture into discussions about the design of the licence plate. There have been enough political careers founder on that, and mine is not going to be one of them.

I would like to suggest that this service and this initiative not be a cost to the veterans. We should be able to exchange these licence plates, and if the Legion has a cost in administering the search for service records and so on, we have many agreements with non-government organizations, and I am certain that we could assist in some way with that and not make it an onerous cost to veterans or a cost at all to veterans. We should be able to do this.

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The other point I would like to make about the licence plates — as the government moves forward with the motion — and on this action in the regulations is that I think it will do more than recognize the veterans driving these vehicles. I think it will also encourage every one of us to provide the courtesy to them that we might not otherwise, and it will help us all to stop and think and to perhaps, in a friendly manner, acknowledge them and recognize their service to all of us and their contribution to the world we live in today.

Thank you very much. I commend the motion and encourage all members to support it.

Mr. Cathers:   It’s a pleasure and really an honour to stand here today to address this motion. I would like to thank the other members who have spoken so far for their words regarding this motion. I would urge all members of this House to support the motion. I think it’s very important that we recognize the contribution of our veterans.

Too often in this society we get caught up in the fast pace and we forget to stop and remember where all the freedoms in our society come from, why we have them and why we’re all standing here today instead of living in a much different and much less free society than we do. We forget about the men and women who put their lives on the line to protect our freedom. When we do talk, when we do remember those who have risked so much and sacrificed so much for us, we are usually standing inside heated rooms in our nice clean clothes and very comfortable in our nice peaceful society.

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As we stand there, it is easy to focus on the pomp and the ceremony and think of lofty terms like “glory” and “honour”, and it’s easy to forget that our freedoms were not defended in a nice, clean, comfy room or on a parade square, they were defended out in the battlefield. We do not know — we cannot even really begin to comprehend — the hours that our soldiers spent lying in the cold wet mud of battlefields, probably scared and far from home. They did it for us; they did it for their country as it was then; they did it for the future — and we are the future. We have an obligation to remember that.

When we look at the faces of the veterans, particularly of the two World Wars, we see senior citizens. We don’t see them as the young boys or young women they were when they went off to war, when they marched into battle, forcing down their fear to fight for their country, to fight for their families and for everything that they hold dear. We don’t see the faces of those who never came home.

I remember looking at my grandfather, who served in the military during the Second World War. I remember the look on his face and the tears in his eyes on Remembrance Day. He wasn’t someone who was really given to that type of display of emotion. It chokes me up a bit to think of that and to realize that I can’t even begin to comprehend what they faced, but I thank them for it. I could not thank them more sincerely for what they did to protect everything that we hold dear.

Those of us who sit in this Legislative Assembly should remember the words of the poem In Flanders Field, and not forget that we have duty to not break faith with those who died. Those of us in this House certainly do not face the dangers as our soldiers did. We too have a duty to defend the freedoms in our society.

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People think that we live in a peaceful world. And they forget that we live in a peaceful country, in a world that, in many cases, is filled with chaos. Our country remains peaceful to this day only because of men and women who stand between us and those who would tear it down for their own gain.

We owe a great debt of gratitude to those who have served in our nation’s armed forces, both past and present, and we can never repay that debt of gratitude. But I believe that establishing a special licence plate for veterans is one small way — one very small way, in comparison to what they’ve given — in which we can recognize their service and recognize them for the risks they have taken for us.

I urge all members of this House to support this motion, and I thank the members who have spoken on this. I also thank the Member for Pelly-Nisutlin for bringing this motion forward, the Minister of Tourism and Culture, and the Member for Whitehorse West for bringing this forward on behalf of her constituents and for doing work on her constituents’ behalf.

I believe this is something that will be well supported by people across the Yukon. I believe it should be supported.

I think this motion is timely, coming before Remembrance Day. I would urge the department whose responsibility this is to move forward with this, together with the Royal Canadian Legion, and work to develop a plate as quickly as possible, recognizing that many of the people who served in the two World Wars, in particular, are not getting any younger. It’s important that we give them the recognition while we still can. I would urge them to move forward with that quickly, and ensure that this plate is done at no cost to our veterans.

In closing, Mr. Speaker, I would finally, one last time, like to express my gratitude and my thanks to all of our veterans.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Mr. Arntzen:  It is a great pleasure to speak to this motion today. Because of these veterans and their efforts around the world, my parents were able to return to their home from a previously occupied homeland where my mother was able to give birth to her second child. I am today very thankful that I have been able to grow up in a free land. And 58 years later, my family is also able to bear fruits of the freedoms that were fought for. And for that, I am grateful and thankful.

Mr. Speaker, we all know that we owe a great debt to our veterans who fought in all wars for our freedom that we today enjoy so much in Canada and the Yukon in particular. I would also like to acknowledge our peacekeepers who have served all over the world since 1947. The Blue Berets, as they were called, have been worn by over 100,000 Canadians. And I had that privilege to wear a Blue Beret for a short time at a very young age. And I must say, I have the utmost respect for our peacekeepers all around the world, and in particular Canadians, for all the work they have done and continue to do.

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Many of the provinces and the Northwest Territories are already going forward with this initiative or project, so I simply say, let’s join them, and I’ll be voting for this motion.

Mr. Fairclough:   I will be short in my response to this motion also. I do not have a problem with this motion. We do support recognition of our veterans and having the Royal Canadian Legion head up the design of a licence plate in recognition of our veterans; although I would like to mention the fact that, for a long time now, aboriginal people have been trying to get Canada to recognize and compensate aboriginal veterans and that process is still ongoing. We haven’t come to an end yet. We are losing a lot of our aboriginal veterans, and I hope that the people who go forward in designing this licence plate take into consideration the fact that Canada had aboriginal people fighting on their behalf to defend this country. They did so by knowingly giving up their aboriginal rights and that is a big move. I don’t think they even realized, years down the road, the impacts this would have on their children and their grandchildren in trying to get recognition for being aboriginal people again. That and many other things — marriage, for example, and losing your aboriginal rights — those were tough battles from an aboriginal point of view — in just getting the rights recognized back.

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I think that this could be part of the design of a plate. And in doing so, even if we’re the only region that has that recognition on the plate, that’s a great accomplishment on Yukon’s behalf, and perhaps the Legion or whoever is designing this licence plate could really look at that seriously.

I do have some concerns. I don’t know if the licence plate is the best thing to do for our veterans. I know that even the Yukon government is trying to get away from having their vehicles identified as government vehicles with the licence plates. Others are trying to get away and go to normal plates so that there isn’t vandalism, for example, to the vehicles and even for safety concerns, knowing that most of our veterans now are a lot older.

There are a good number of aboriginal veterans in my riding — or from my riding, the Selkirk First Nation, for example — who are not living there any more. I have noticed, and it is quite noticeable, in the community of Carmacks during Remembrance Day that we don’t have any veterans left in the community. Now, I might be wrong today about others coming to live in the community, but there isn’t that celebration there that there used to be. I know the last person who passed away in Carmacks had lived there for so many years and had family there and had chosen the community of Carmacks to be their home. I think it is recognized throughout Canada and the rest of the world that we are losing a lot of our veterans. The numbers are going down rapidly. In this day and age, the whole issue of war is on our minds constantly. We see it every day on television. We see death. We see the peacekeepers we send overseas dying. We see it on television but we don’t really see the impact because Canada is such a peaceful place still.

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We don’t have the threats in this country that others do. I think we are thankful and fortunate to be able to live in such a peaceful place today. So, in designing the licence plates, I do believe that if there was one done, there should not be a cost to our veterans at all. We should use whatever organizations and departments we have in government to assist them in designing this licence plate.

I guess that was a big concern we had. I know that there was so much controversy over the designing of a licence plate. This one is specific, and I don’t think we would go through any of the complications that we had in the past.

I don’t know — is this for a year or is this an ongoing thing? That hasn’t really been clarified by government. Is this a one-time recognition? Those are questions that could be answered or maybe even direction given to the Royal Canadian Legion when they do design these licence plates.

We support this initiative, and I thank the member for bringing it forward. We all need to be thankful for our veterans and the fact that they put their lives on the line for us.

Mr. Rouble:   It is my honour and my pleasure to speak in support of this motion today.

The last Friday in October is the start of the remembrance period. It is traditionally the first day that one can start wearing a poppy in preparing for the upcoming Remembrance Day on November 11. So, I think that it’s appropriate that we have this debate at the beginning of this celebratory period. It’s a time to remember, a time to reflect, a time to consider the actions of our veterans and our peacekeepers.

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November 11 is typically a cold, rainy, snowy day. Again it’s a day for contemplation, remembrance, for thanks and, to a degree, for celebration to celebrate the lives we have and that we’re able to have because of the people who fought for our rights and our way of life.

It’s a day when people like Mr. Floyd Buchanan, Mr. Gary Henry, or Mr. Drew Dunn, and other veterans get together. We usually have a celebration in the Carcross school where veterans, family members, members of the services, such as the RCMP or the Canadian Rangers, and the school kids get together to commemorate the actions of our veterans. Typically we only do that once a year on that one day, but I think we need to do more. We need to do more to say thank you. We have a responsibility and a debt to these people and they deserve our honour.

I am pleased to support this motion that calls for the Yukon government to work with the Royal Canadian Legion to design and develop a veterans licence plate in recognition of Yukon veterans and their efforts to protect our country and preserve peace around the world.

Now this is a small gesture, but it is another way of thanking them, acknowledging them and honouring those people. I am pleased to hear the support for this motion today, the support coming from the opposition benches, and I’m proud that we’re working together to go forward with this. I am also very happy to hear that this hasn’t been treated as a political football and that it hasn’t been used for making points. 

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This motion came about because of a request from veterans, and I am pleased to see that government is responding to that request. I know that the Department of Highways and Public Works, the department that is responsible for issuing licence plates, has been working on this, as well as the Member for Pelly-Nisutlin who brought the motion forward and the Minister of Tourism and Culture who has championed this in our caucus. I’d like to thank those members and the department for all their hard work so far.

Once we approve this and get the ball rolling, I know they’ll have more work to do and more consultation to do. I am confident that in working with the Royal Canadian Legion we’ll be able to accomplish this objective and find a reasonable and appropriate way of coming up with this plate and a process. Also, I would like to share with my colleagues and put forward the concept that this not cost the veterans a penny out of their own pockets. I think this is another way that we can honour them, and I’m sure that we can find the funds somewhere in our budget.

It was also brought up earlier that there might be safety concerns about this and the problem with identifying a vehicle in a specific manner. I would just like to remind members that this would be an option for people, and if they felt it wasn’t appropriate or that they didn’t want it, there would be no obligation on them to have to have this type of licence plate, but that it is another way of celebrating their history and their commitment.

Earlier in my speech I mentioned a couple of specific veterans by name. I am quite certain that in the beautiful Southern Lakes there are other members and other veterans, and I wish to apologize to them for not including them. Their efforts have not been forgotten.

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Again I’d like to thank the Member for Pelly-Nisutlin for bringing this forward, and I would urge all members of our Assembly to support this motion.

Thank you.

Mr. Cardiff:   It gives me great pleasure to rise today to speak in support of this motion. I think that the members previously talked about this and have made many good comments, comments that are relevant.

If we look around the world today, there are many conflicts going on, and we need to be thankful for where we live. This is the time of year when we do that.

I know that on November 11, Remembrance Day, we always think about those who have been on the battlefield, who have put their lives ahead of others, served their country and worked toward achieving a solution — basically, to stop wars so that people can live in peace.

There are many other people during conflicts and wars who aren’t often recognized. I feel that they do deserve to be recognized, maybe not with a licence plate but I think they need to be mentioned as well. Often when men and women go off to the battlefield, their families are left at home — wives, children, parents, grandparents — and many of those people make their contributions as well through working, raising families, working in factories. We need to remember those people as well.

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There are other people who served in the merchant marine and other areas who made large contributions to the war efforts. I feel this licence plate is going to serve as a reminder every day of the dedication of those people who served on the battlefield. Year-round we’ll be able to walk down the street, watch a car drive by, or when we’re driving home from work we’ll see that, and it won’t matter if it’s November 11. It can be any time of the year. We need to remember those things year-round. We need to remember the commitment and the dedication of those who fought for us so we could live in a free country and, at the same time, remind us of the conflicts that go on around the world to this day, so we can all work together to try to achieve a more peaceful world, and we can live in a more peaceful world.

I support this. I’d like to thank the members for bringing this forward and for the work they’ve done on it. I would encourage them to work with the Royal Canadian Legion on the design and administration to ensure that people who would like one of these plates, and are veterans, can have one. I agree there should be no cost to veterans. They paid the price long ago so we could live in the country we live in, and we should be thankful for that.

I look forward to seeing these licence plates so we have that reminder, and that it reminds us that we all have to work hard in our lives and in the jobs we do, representing our constituents and working toward a more peaceful world, country and community.

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Hon. Mr. Lang:   I stand in support of this. I would like to compliment the member who brought it forward as well as Wayne Wannamker, who brought it to our attention. I think that sometimes in our busy lives we forget to look backward because we are so busy looking forward. I think these kinds of issues are very, very important.

In the past, in Canada, we presented ourselves as a nation — first of all, as a growing nation, by identifying ourselves with many conflicts that were off our shores: the First World War, of course, the Second World War and the Korean War and, of course, we can’t forget about the representation we have in many countries today; for example, in the Cypress situation that went on for years — we had representation in the UN there. Today we have fellow Canadians in Afghanistan doing the job of helping these countries get back on track and move forward.

So, in recognizing the military or the vets in our country — not only the ones who were my father and my children’s grandfathers who fought in the Second World War and the Korean War, but it’s also to remind people that there are still people out there fighting for our way of life. Fighting for our way of life means that we have sacrifices. We have people who are willing to sacrifice their lives for what we stand for in the world.

So, this licence plate is recognizing a sign on a vehicle that these people are vets, have put a little bit of their time in to defend Canada and our way of life. So, at the end of the day, when we see these on vehicles, it will remind us — I think that maybe you can see this going across Canada, as the other eight provinces and jurisdictions have done.

I think it’s important for us to remember that we do have a military and that military is very important to our way of life, and to remind us that there are people working every day in the military world to defend what we believe in and to defend our borders. I think that by not recognizing the fact that that part of our society or our country is necessary, we tend to ignore that, and we ignore it to our peril.

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As we see federally, they utilize the budgets and all these things that are important to a military that they don’t receive because Joe Blow citizen doesn’t have the recognition of how important this part of our society is. So by having these licence plates on vehicles, I think it will give everybody who drives by — a light will go on and you’ll say, “Oh, by the way, that’s a veteran.” And that’s a good sign. I, for one, notice ranger licence plates. The rangers have a licence plate, so when I drive by one of the vehicles and it has got a Ranger plate, I automatically associate that with the Rangers, understanding that there are 5,000 Rangers working in northern Canada to serve the military needs of this region. A very important part of our north-of-60 defences is involved with the training of local people, Rangers who are equipped by the military to do the job if in fact they’re called on. So that licence plate is very recognizable when you see it on the road.

I think this vets plate will do the same thing. It will remind us of that part of us that fought in wars past and fought in peacekeeping in the present, and that we do have a military that’s alive and well in Canada and also overseas.

I can understand the members opposite when one questioned the security of licence plates on, let’s say, seniors’ vehicles, which, in a sense, could make them a target for vandalism or whatever, and another member said that of course it’s a choice that people make. It’s not by law that you have to have the plate if you’re a veteran. Some people aren’t comfortable with that. In my generation, there were people who weren’t comfortable talking about the war. They were uncomfortable. They spent four or five years in the war and they spent it in many parts of Europe, north Africa or in Asia, but they didn’t want to be reminded of it. It was a very private experience and sometimes not a very good experience.

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Again, those kinds of decisions will be made by the individual. I think this plate will recognize the fact that we do have a military in the country; we do have people who have served us not only in the past but serve us today. It will remind all of us when we see that plate, just what it is. It will be amazing for us, once we see the plates out there, how many people have served our country, whether it’s in peacekeeping or in wars in the past.

I think working with the Legion is very important because the Legion was formed in the 1920s — I think about 1926. It was actually formed for the military people to get some recognition from the government for certain pensions, so there was a reason for the Legion when it started. It grew into the numbers that it had in the 1950s, and of course now it doesn’t have the same membership because we haven’t had the situation we had in either Korea or in the Second World War where we had hundreds of thousands of people in the military who did a very, very fine job of the job at hand.

We cannot forget that our military in the Second World War was one of the top notch militaries in the world. Our merchant fleet was the largest fleet in the world. We serviced all of Europe from the North American borders. Our sailors, our merchant marine were the top in the world. Those people were all young people. In the military in Canada, when the statistics on a bomber in the Second World War —  for a five-man crew, their ages might not add up to 100. I mean, we’re talking about the young and the cream of the crop who volunteered and went forward to fight for our country. In three wars, whether it’s the First World War, Second World War or Korean, we in Canada lost 117,000 individuals with an average age of probably 20 or 25 — young people who were just starting out in their careers or their lives, took time out of their lives to fight for what we stood for.

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I think to have this licence place, recognizing it’s a very small token of our respect and our admiration for those individuals, I think by working with the Legion, it recognizes the importance of the Legion in this effort. I hope we can make this as simple as possible for the vets, so it’s not a complicated thing to get recognized. I think that by going through the Legion, they could be a big part of that recognition and the verification to make sure that these people are eligible for the vets plate.

But as far as having the plate, I think it’s important that we talk about it in the House, that we recognize the fact that November 11 is coming up, and November 11 is a very important date for all Canadians. I think that over the years it hasn’t had the same input as it had in the 1950s or the 1960s when there were a great many people who had actually experienced war. I think we can talk about war, we can talk about battles and we can talk about confrontational situations that these young people met up with, but that’s all we can do, is discuss it. These people lived it. When we talk about our young men who are in Afghanistan today, they’re living it. I mean, they might be on a peacekeeping mission, but it’s not peacekeeping if people are shooting at you. And they always are under the stress of the fact that at any time they could be in a very, very military situation that will demand training and would demand the high amount of training that our troops get.

In the last couple of weeks, we’ve had discussions about our submarine fleet. One of the subs we bought from the United Kingdom had some problems in the Atlantic. Well, it’s not the first Canadian ship that had some problems in the Atlantic. It is a very sad situation when anybody dies in those kinds of situations, but it’s the nature of the business.

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I’m not saying that I can’t tell you or tell this House that what happened on that submarine was our fault, their fault or whose fault, but it did happen. Of course we have to address those issues when they arise. But again, those are the kinds of things our military does on a day-to-day basis. They have issues all the time. They have modernization problems, they have money problems — all of these things go hand in hand with being in the military and actually operating the military in any country.

So we have to prioritize the money we give to the military, and the management of the military is the military’s job. And going back to the submarines, they make these hard decisions: what can we buy for our military that will be sufficient to cover our needs in the next 10 years? They plan 10 or 15 years ahead. So, as far as the military is concerned, at the end of the day I think we get a good bang for our buck. I think they do an exceptional job, and by putting this vet plate in front of our vehicles, I think we’ll remember what they do as we drive by them and we’ll also remember the issue about military — that it is part of our society. It’s a part of our society that in Canada today and in the capacity we have — understanding we have only 30 million people in Canada. That’s not a lot of people when you talk about other nations around the world. 30 million people is a very small population for a very massive piece of real estate. We have the largest coastline in the world. The military has the responsibility to defend that coastline. Those people are out there on a daily basis, and I imagine that’s partially what the military was thinking when they bought those five submarines from the U.K. — the need to defend those coastlines.

So I think that as we go through and readjust our thought pattern about why we have a military, what necessity it is, and as we put our young people in harm’s way, such as in Afghanistan, under the auspices of peace, I think what we have to do is recognize that they’re there. And by putting this plate in front of the people who come back from these experiences in the military, it not only recognizes the individual but it recognizes the task at hand.

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At the end of the day, those individuals went across wherever they went and joined up for the military, spent their two to four years in uniform under very, very — the payscale is not large. Your heart has to be in it or you wouldn’t be in it. We have a totally volunteer armed forces. All of those individuals have volunteered to serve their country and I take my hat off to them. I think it’s very important for the House here on this decision — it’s a unanimous decision. I hope it turns out to be that. But I think it’s important to recognize the fact that we have people out there; they have a job to defend us and defend our borders. I think they do a tremendous job. I don’t think we get enough time to recognize that on a daily basis. We do on November 11. But again, that’s one day a year.

This will remind us, like the Ranger licence plate, that there are people out there committed to work with us to defend our way of life.

So I, as a member of the House here, recommend that we unanimously make a decision and recognize the vets and also the licence plate that will go on their vehicles, and I recommend that we work with the Royal Canadian Legion. I think the design is a question that can be decided by other people. All I would like to do is have something that can recognize the hard work that our forefathers did and that the people who are in the field today are doing as we sit in this House.

So, Mr. Speaker, I am in total support of this motion to recognize the vets with a licence plate.

Thank you.

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Mrs. Peter:   I stand in support of this motion before us. I feel very grateful to have a homeland like Canada. In this homeland we’re able to enjoy some freedom. We’re able to enjoy some sense of security. We’re able to enjoy some sense of peace. This motion before us, I feel, acknowledges all people who participated so that we can have some kind of a peaceful life today. When we talk about the wars throughout history, I think about the families that had to make huge sacrifices. Sometimes their sons, their husbands, their daughters didn’t come back home, and yet they were proud that they were able to stand up for their country.

On one of my visits to Fairbanks in Alaska, where my husband’s home is, I witnessed a ceremony on November 11. That ceremony was to celebrate with and to acknowledge the First Nation veterans throughout Alaska. I felt so very honoured and so very humbled to be there.

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I believe we can all learn from this. Our military in Canada participates throughout the world in peacekeeping missions, and in the north we have our Rangers who help in so many areas of our life in the communities.

When I think about the war in Afghanistan, one of our Gwich’in relatives was participating in a peaceful mission and was able to come back to Canada and Old Crow and share his experiences in Old Crow. I know of a few Gwich’in men from Alaska who are participating in that war in Iraq.

The people of Old Crow, Mr. Speaker, are very much aware of what goes on throughout the world. They know the events that are happening out there. Every time I listen to an elder praying at a gathering in our language, they always pray for the people who don’t live in a peaceful place. They pray for the people who are involved in the war; they pray for the women and children who live in those areas and, at the end of their prayer, they always give thanks for our peaceful community.

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So today as we speak, in my community there is a search being undertaken by the Rangers, and we’re hoping for a good outcome, that one of our community members is safe. That is what this is all about — acknowledgement of people who make a difference in our lives, of people who care enough to stand up for what they believe in, and they stand up for their values. This licence plate is an idea, and it is only a small token of our appreciation. I am in support of that, like all the speakers before me. It will be a reminder, and we need that. We need to remember where we came from, who our people are, and where our roots are.

Mahsi’ cho.

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 Hon. Mr. Hart:   It’s a great honour to rise today in the Legislature and support my colleague’s motion.

This motion speaks to the respect for veterans. It speaks to the value of the Royal Canadian Legion as a representative of the veterans here in the Yukon and across Canada. This motion offers this Legislature a rare opportunity to send a clear message to all Yukoners that our veterans are held in high regard. At the heart of this motion is a message that this government is looking for ways to recognize our veterans and to pay homage for their sacrifices on our behalf.

Creating a new licence plate is in no way paying off a debt owed to veterans. Nothing we could do can ever repay that debt. That has been mentioned here by many of my colleagues on this side as well as the other.

However, it is incumbent upon the governments to find ways to at least acknowledge this debt. Just last week, the federal government introduced the world’s first coloured circulation coin. As the member from the third party indicated, it’s a quarter emblazoned with a red poppy. It’s a gesture of respect and, most importantly, remembrance.

By combining remembrance with common elements of everyday life, governments are able to send a clear message to a wide audience about our debt load to veterans. That’s what the creation of a special veteran plate would do. As the member opposite indicated, by seeing it on a vehicle in the middle of July, it will remind us of the fact that it is a veteran — not just on November 11. I think it’s a small, significant issue, but I think it’s an important one for many Yukon veterans.

Given the wide availability elsewhere, I believe that it’s time for the Yukon to join with other jurisdictions and give veterans the opportunity to proclaim their status through their plates.

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Once again the government is aware that it is a small gesture, as has been previously mentioned, but it is a gesture that is easily made and it affords the veterans official recognition. In Yukon where our licence plates are so distinctive and valued, it would be an especially appropriate gesture.

I will state that we will be working with the Royal Canadian Legion on this design and makeup to ensure that the respective licence plate is maintained, still giving the veterans distinction on that plate itself.

I see the motion as an opportunity to make a small, simple gesture to our veterans in recognition of their service. I see it as one way that a government can recognize the elevated position of veterans in our community. I see it as an initiative that provides those eligible with the opportunity to proudly proclaim their status as veterans.

But this motion goes beyond simple recognition and respect for those individuals. My colleagues introduced a motion that calls on the government to recognize the important role that the Royal Canadian Legion plays as a community organization and, just as importantly, the role it plays in representing the interests and values of individual Yukon veterans.

Given the Legion’s status, any time a gesture like this one is considered, it is incumbent upon us to go to the organization and get input from its membership. Locally, we can look at the Royal Canadian Legion Branch 254. The members of our local branch, like all Legion members across Canada, represent the bravery and sacrifice of all Yukon armed service personnel. More than that, they represent the collective memory of our territory’s contribution to Canada’s efforts on a national stage. We must include them at any time we undertake a commemorative project.

Governments can take steps to recognize veterans. They can commemorate veteran contributions to our society. They can even develop plans to create a new plate, but they cannot match the Legion’s ability to represent the interests of Yukon veterans.

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It is an organization that represents and understands the sensibilities and wishes of the veterans, because it shares those sensibilities and those wishes.

When my colleague put forward the motion calling on the government to work with the Legion, I take that as an indication of his recognition of the Legion’s role. We can join my colleague in demonstrating our respect for the Legion by approving this motion unanimously.

Mr. Speaker, my grandfather served in the British infantry and he told me many stories of going to war in France. I’ve passed those stories on to my family, and I hope they will pass those ventures on to their family to ensure the veterans’ cause of the Second World War and subsequent wars is not lost.

We are in conversation with the local Legion and their process to look at the prospect of dealing with the allied forces that make up the peacekeeping corps and looking at their eligibility for the plate also. We are working on that criterion with them to help them move along those lines and hopefully recognize those people and satisfy a couple of the questions presented by the members opposite.

Mr. Speaker, the fact that we can even debate the motion in a free and elected legislature is a testament to the sacrifice and efforts of our country’s veterans. As politicians in a democratic society, our every decision and act was made possible by the veterans serving on behalf of all Canadians in environments and situations that most of us can’t even imagine or don’t even want to imagine.

The benefits we all reap as a direct result of the lives lost and shattered in war is something we commemorate far less often than we should. One day a year, on November 11, we stand as a nation and as a world and commemorate those who died in wars that have marred the past century.

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And as mentioned earlier, we have ongoing situations in the rest of the world even as we speak today, such as Afghanistan and those processes.

We pay our respects to those veterans who live with the memories of war. But November 11 isn’t enough. If there is some other way we can provide year-round recognition, then we must do that. As I said, other jurisdictions already commemorate veterans with a special recognition plate. In those jurisdictions, the Legion plays a significant role, not only in the plate design but in the ongoing delivery of the program.

Applications for veteran status are handled through the Legion on behalf of the governments. That way, veterans are deciding who qualifies based on a clear set of standards for designating who is and who isn’t a veteran. Governments need not get involved in that kind of work, especially when there is an organization so closely tied to that issue. Of course, governments must administer any plate and, hopefully, pay for all forms and costs of that particular aspect. But designating veteran status is a very important task, and one that the Legion is best able to fulfill.

This year is an especially auspicious year to undertake the creation of a veterans plate. This past summer, we all commemorated the 60^th anniversary of D-Day. And just this week, veterans from the Italian Campaign returned to Europe to commemorate the 60^th anniversary of a long battle waged on Italian soil. Canadian and Italian officials gathered with veterans to remember the 855 Canadians who died during 22 months of fighting at the gates of Rome.

Those kinds of sacrifices are beyond repayment. It falls to us, at the least — at the very least — to remember and to go beyond remembrance and provide official recognition where possible. That’s what a veterans plate would do, and that’s what the plate would allow any veteran who wanted it — to declare their status.

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It would send a clear signal that the government acknowledges the contribution of our veterans. It will serve as a constant reminder to all who see the plates that the Yukon is built on the backs of those who served on our behalf. Mr. Speaker, any government that is given an opportunity to undertake such a project should embrace the opportunity. And as my colleague suggests, the project should be undertaken hand in hand with the Royal Canadian Legion. I commend him for putting forward the motion and I look forward to unanimous support from this Legislature.

Mr. Hardy:   I rise in support of this motion, as I believe all my colleagues do and I would suspect all members of the Legislature do. It is not a difficult motion to find support for. It is in recognition of those who have fought for the quality of life that we are fortunate to experience today. And I hope it recognizes not just those who fought but those who contributed to the struggle for peace in the world, throughout the world.

So when I see acknowledgement of veterans or take part in ceremonies such as on Remembrance Day, I often think of those who are closest to me and who have been affected by the war. All I have to do is think of my father and think of my uncles and think of my aunts who contributed to the work and struggle during the Second World War.

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I look at that not with a lot of happiness and not a lot of pride, in that sense, but with a lot of sadness because I see my father as a victim of the war. I see my uncles and aunts, but mostly my uncles, as victims as well. Victims of a situation, victims of a fault in the character of human beings that we cannot get along, that we cannot strive to improve the quality of life for all people, that we cannot put other people ahead of ourselves, ahead of our countries, that we cannot look globally at the world. So much conflict happens because of a fault within our character, and it seems to be inherent in our character. We continually repeat history and a tragic style of history. We don’t have to look very far today to see atrocities happening around the world. We can look at Iraq. One of the things that shamed me about Iraq — besides what happened there, and I still totally disagree with the United States and Britain going there and basically creating a conflict when there was no proof — was the tremendous loss of life that we don’t hear about and the disruption and destruction of families and children and the future.

That is war. That is pure and simple war. That was a war brought about not by defending anything.

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Our veterans defended, and Canada is a very proud country to be peacekeepers, but war happens because we cannot resolve issues; we cannot resolve positions without conflict. We see it happen time and time and time again, and we are living it today. Rwanda — 800,000 people dead. We never hear of the Iraqi losses — it’s tens of thousands. I don’t have any idea. We only hear of a few losses of people who live in North America — and there are the injured — and the hundreds of years that it is going to take to resolve this issue.

So, war is not something to be proud of. That’s why I struggle with — I am very proud of Canadians and what they’ve done, fighting for peace, but I’m not proud to be engaged in war. I am not proud that human nature seems to resort to conflict to resolve issues or problems.

There are so many casualties and so many families affected by war. As I said at the beginning, I only have to think of my family. My father was a casualty of war, because he was never able to move beyond it. He was never able to deal with what he saw in the trenches and what he experienced. Nor were my uncles, nor many other people I met and know. But it meant a lot to him to know that the country he fought for did not forget him, did not forget the struggle, did not pretend it didn’t happen and try to move on. </